M SERIES. A NEW INSTALLATION.

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M SERIES. A NEW INSTALLATION.

Postby Dr Benway » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:00 am

The installation of this old desk is LOOoong over due. It'll be living in a small 100 sqM studio in Australia that I'm putting together..
As mentioned in Gareth's post, We'll be firing life into her on Tuesday.. It's be idle for over 2 years so I'm proceeding with caution and a little hesitation too. Fingers crossed hey!!!

Gareth.. The PSU's are as follows.
3 x ZN 1293 desk psu's
2 x ZN 1296 logic psu's
1 x ZN 1137 mic psu..

I'm not sure how these differ form the psu's you've mentioned??
I think in a previous conversation we've had you mentioned you thought this particular desk was quite an early M series which may explain the psu's.

I'll report back with some pic's also as we make headway into it..
Thanks for the advice thus far too. It's good to know there's knowledge out there on these things!!!
Dr Benway
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Postby GJC Designs » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:09 am

The lower model numbers probably fit in with the early age of the console.
The same principles of powering-up should apply.
I don't know the differences between these and the later ZN1997/ZN1998 PSUs.
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Postby Dr Benway » Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:06 pm

All in all the power up of the desk went really well!!! I have to say I was surprised and quite relieved.. Of course there were a few issues with it which was to be expected I guess but there was NO smoke, fire or explosions!!
The major issue being the lack of a connecting cable from the phantom power supply to the desk.. This wasn't supplied when I took delivery of the desk and I only just realized it yesterday.. My question is.. How difficult would it be to either find a suitable cable or find the connectors and make the cable my self??
The other problem was the switches on the modules.. Phase reverse, eq in/out afl ect switches.. Some of these were intermittent and a few would not connect at all.. If i have to replace a few I guess I should do the whole desk but my question regarding this issue is with which switch do I replace them with???
Other than that the whole day went quite smooth all things considered. It was powered up all up around 30 times from no modules to being fully loaded and the psu's and the desk seemed to handle it very well indeed..
After going over it with a fine tooth comb I was really blown away by how well built it is.. No corners seemed to have been cut by Calrec back in the day and in fact my tech and I commented through out the day that we felt is was over built.. Not in a bad way by any means just in a way you don't see too often in this day and age..
I'll be powering it up again over the next few days for a few hours each day and we'll be going over the routing matrix, I/O's and patchbay in a couple of weeks..
Dr Benway
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Postby Matt Syson » Thu Jun 26, 2008 10:34 am

Hi
Glad things went well.
Be wary of any switchcleaners unless you get RELIABLE info from Gareth or Richard as I did a trial many years ago and proved that a 'fancy' type actually welded the plastic together (but the contacts were very clean!).
The power supplies were the variety before the ZN1997 / 8 version vut are broadly similar circuit (if I remember correctly) but with more hand wiring involved.
These supplies use a 37.5 volt 5 Amp supply and an active divider to get the 'centre tap'.
The phantom can be wired up with 5 amp cable and any connectors you fancy. Nothing special here. Are they not 4 or 5 pin XLR types? The main supplies are 3 and 5 pin Cannon EP types (now made by Alcatel).
Actually if it is the same diameter as the main supplies it will be an 8 pin Cannon EP.
I would be interested in seeing photos of your desk as it sounds like it was from 'my time' there.
I would suggest recapping the power supplies in the near future to be 'on the safe side' as I heard from a guy in USA who got his desk running and one or two of the caps 'went' (I don't know how dramatic it was but if you are not familiar with this stuff it can look bad!).
Matt S
(PMS on the drawings/ test stickers)
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Postby Dr Benway » Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

Hi Matt. Thanks for the advice re switch cleaners!!
Ok.. The phantom psu connectors are indeed the 8 pin cannon type.. Any ideas where I could track down the same connectors??
Another thing I didn't mention was the missing pcb.. !
In the back are slots for 3 cards for the main output channels on the desk..
The slots read as follows.
BL 1408 (1) Main Out..
BL 1408 (2) Bypass Out..
BL 1408 (3) MCF Out..
We've installed the BL 1408 cards in the main clean feed (3) slot and in the main out (1) slot..
We're missing a card for the Bypass out slot.. How worried should I be??

There are plenty of pictures of these things too which would help I guess but pardon my ignorance, I can't for the life of me work out how to post pics here!!! What am I not doing???
Thanks again for all the help.
Dr Benway
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Postby Matt Syson » Sat Jun 28, 2008 8:06 am

Hi
I believe you are in OZ so I have no idea for local connector supplies but Farnell (possibly) Canford Audio or RS may be a starting point. They are made by Alcatel (Australian I believe).
Missing a couple of cards is a bit of a 'downer' but in reality you may not need them as there may be others doing different functions you don't actually NEED. Look at the big block schematic which shows what all the cards do and how they are wired for YOUR desk.
Main out, you need to 'create' somehow. Bypass could be unnecessary, dependinf what you want to do, and MCF (main cleen feed is again not necessary for a 'recording' setup.
I presume you are aware that any card with a given number will fit in any slot with that number (interchangeable).
No idea n posting pics, sorry but if you wish you could email them to me direct for assistance.
If you don't have the actual manual for YOUR desk then things will get a bit tricky without a lot of head scratching and lying on your back under the desk trying to examine the connectors (I've been there for over 30 years now!).
A pic of the output section of the block would help me suggest what could be changed if you can't get any more 1408's.
Matt S
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Postby Dr Benway » Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:10 pm

Thanks Matt. I'll e.mail you pics directly..
We have a 2 full manuals for the desk that are in great order (they smell to high heaven too for some reason??!!!)
I was aware the the cards were inter changeable.. All good there.
Not to worry if I can't track down another BL 1408 card.. If we don't have to use the MCF channel no issue really..
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Postby Matt Syson » Sun Jun 29, 2008 2:31 pm

Hi
I will reply to your email directly but for general info. yes the Phantom power is on an EP8 (Cannon). If I spot a source in the UK I will reply to you.
I want to see your manuals now out of interest but again I will reply with more specific questions and answers.
Matt S
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Re: M SERIES. A NEW INSTALLATION.

Postby Dr Benway » Sun May 02, 2010 11:09 pm

Thought I should give an up date on the install of my desk.. I'll be honest and tell you that it has been a major pain the #%$@ to get it to where it is now but its something that I'm enormously happy and proud of.. In short.. I'm loving it!! My tech, Greg, has been an absolute God send and I'm eternally grateful for his help and friendship through out the entire process..
It was moved into place at the studio almost 12 months ago now from where it sat, in my garage, being powered up, cleaned and generally looked over by my myself and Greg. All went very well at that stage as I've previously posted.. The desk had a few issues however they all seemed to be pretty straight forward to address.. Once it was installed in its new location we had the psu's re capped and went over the desk once more for faults.. Save for a couple of channels that didn't pass signal (2 in all I think) and a few scratch faders, it was looking good.. Most of the things we were looking for at this point were things that were extraneous to our needs.. Most of the centre section matrix (however this may be of use regarding the monitor paths.. See below..) the 'producers' section on the left of the desk (tape transports ect..) and so on.. The patchbay it came with (GPO) was eventually the patchbay we kept. It was going to be exchanged for TT but the cost to do it seemed to out weigh the pros of it.. The realestate the original pb takes up is something I can live with plus the time to wire from scratch would have been even more time consuming.. We actually added to it quite a bit to it but all the original patch panels are still attached at his stage.. We haven't been game to snip them off just yet!! They're tucked up neatly under the desk out of harms way. For its purpose in this studio we had to interface Pro Tools HD, a couple of tape machines, a large assortment of outboard effects, Mic lines to 4 separate rooms.. Plus the other things that we 'think' we'll need in the future.. Gregs work on the patchbay was both time consuming and exhausting. Working out where things on the patchbay came up was a mission in itself.. Let alone the laborious job of soldering.. The channels don't have line level selectors (or do they??) so we had to build a box to accommodate that function for all the 38 channels on the desk. As I've posted here somewhere else, the phantom power supply was shipped to us without the cable. An easy fix but since the phantom power was global across the entire desk we thought we just do with out it.. Standalone phantom psu's are used when the need arises. That or external pre's I have with that function built in.. A 3rd party monitor controller was added to take care of source and monitor paths.. It's a short term fix at this stage but it is something I'd like to ask you all here about.. We were not able to figure out that side of things with the desk as it sits here. We're running, from the MCF outputs on the patchbay, directly into the DAW source inputs of the monitor controller.. From there out to 3 sets of speakers.. Can I do this directly from the desk?? The centre section I mentioned as extraneous above?? If so, how?? I think the configuration of our desk is similar to the desk Gareth is restoring. How have or how would you address this issue??
I'll post some pics of the desk as it was and as it is now in the next few days.. Thanks for reading and let me know if anything above stands out as being odd in your opinions.. I'm always up for making things run more smoothly!!
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Re: M SERIES. A NEW INSTALLATION.

Postby Matt Syson » Mon May 03, 2010 3:54 am

Hi
This series of desk is probably the easiest to customise for the monitoring section as there will be a collection of cards, amplifiers, relays and so on that can be 'reconfigured' easily.
By folowing cable code numbers to the cards you have you should be able to use the bits there but redo the connections to what you want. I would expect having to remake the monitor panel if it doesn't really suit as it is.
The large 'block' diagrams of the desk will actually contain virtually all you need to know to do this and you do not need to get down to 'component' level, simply witre up the various 'blocks'.
Matt S
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